The Birth Certificate debate rages on

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

lol, i finally looked at the link and those letters could easily have come from the same typewriter

Haha, so you were arguing against it without even reading it? That's objective!

[Knifeboy]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

I only argued about one of your comments

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

I don't think they ever claimed it was easy to dig up some document stored somewhere in bureaucratic limbo


Look, if you really want to be a concerned citizen, then stop jumping on the bandwagon of some crackpot conspiracy theorist who's only real accomplishment is to obscure the actual news and troubles worth talking about in america today.
Yes the government lies to you. Every single day. About issues extremely more important than this

If americans keep focusing their energy on stuff like this, eventually this will be all politics is about. You're frightingly close already

Who is jumping on the bandwagon? I'm not promoting this as irrefutable proof. I think it is an extremely important discussion, though. If the guy turns out to be correct, the POTUS just provided forged government documents to the entire citizenry. That is not a little issue for me, no matter who is doing it.

[Knifeboy]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Who is jumping on the bandwagon? I'm not promoting this as irrefutable proof. I think it is an extremely important discussion, though. If the guy turns out to be correct, the POTUS just provided forged government documents to the entire citizenry. That is not a little issue for me, no matter who is doing it.

Yes and if some other conspiracy theorist is right lizards from space are running your government
or george bush blew up the world trade centers
or Dick Cheney eats babies while performing satanic rituals
or Donald Trumps hairpiece is actually a super antenna connected to a spacestation controlled by HAL

Shit like this gets way too much coverage for no fucking reason

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

I only argued about one of your comments

Fair enough. I just can't see any logic in the way it was handled. How has the world changed so dramatically in 2 years? Because some dickwad with a bad comb-over found an audience? I wasn't at all skeptical until this document magically appeared after all of that time. Personally, I thought he should have said that "Mr. Trump is using this previously resolved issue as a way to distract from the actual policies by which my administration and his aspirations should be judged." He led credibility to Trump by responding.

And do you really think anyone affected by Trump's birther proclamations would have voted for Obama anyway? I highly doubt it.
---

Yes and if some other conspiracy theorist is right lizards from space are running your government
or george bush blew up the world trade centers
or Dick Cheney eats babies while performing satanic rituals
or Donald Trumps hairpiece is actually a super antenna connected to a spacestation controlled by HAL

Shit like this gets way too much coverage for no fucking reason

You are using absurdity here instead of logic. Thus, logical fallacies.

Do you consider it an absurd idea that an american politician would forge a document to further his political career? I certainly do not.

[Knifeboy]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

I agree that bowing to trumps demand wasn't necesarry. But the man pretty much covered the newspapers for a couple of weeks. Even over here he was in the paper every day for weeks. That's a scary amount of power.

If Obama hadn't produced a birth certificate, would trump still claim to be running for president? *shrug*

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

If Obama hadn't produced a birth certificate, would trump still claim to be running for president? *shrug*

Would that not have helped Obama's prospects?
---
Well, enjoyed the afternoon debate, but it's time to make like a tree and get the fuck out of here.

[Ars Sycro]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

It really doesn't matter to me, but the timing of the release of the document was pretty sketchy. Why would he sit on it for 2 years if the document was available? Just to piss people off? Why wouldn't he end the argument straight away, and nip it in the bud?

Because it was not his decision on whether or not to release the document? It was the state of Hawaii that had refused to release the original document, since they no longer gave out that version. They gave Obama the same version they would give anybody else who went there today and requested their birth certificate.

It's amazing how Glenn Beck got so many people riled up about this that even the media didn't take the time to explain why it wasn't being released.
---
...

Officials in Hawaii had said state law prohibits them from releasing the information contained in the full birth certificate filing -- even if the president himself requested a copy.

---

lol, i finally looked at the link and those letters could easily have come from the same typewriter


are people seriously forgetting how typewriters work

they are not computers

Exactly. They all look like they're just a difference in pressure and smudging.

[FeebleFables]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Yeah, okay. Keep spending money we don't have and claim to be centrist...

Just like Bush did? Obama, by any worldly measure, is a centrist.

You and I both know that Bill Maher went WAY farther than making jokes about Bushisms.

We do?

Please show a use of "that one" in the current context. You are pulling in outside arguments with no relevance to THIS article. Try to stay on point here.

What? If you want to stay on point, maybe don't drag me into a defense of Bill Maher then and simply focus on the points. McCain refers to Obama as "That one" and it's perfectly apt for the point I'm making.

Of course no one tried to dehumanize Dubya:

Some dude with a lot of free time? who gives a shit. I'm not talking about random people or even comedian pundits, I'm talking about POLITICIANS dehumanizing and illegitemizing Obama for stupid reasons, that are clearly based on more than his and his party's policies.

I'm not saying that you can't agree with ideas of his, but when you start a statement off with "I agree with Bill Maher," that statement's credibility takes an instant hit in my view. Same as "I agree with Rush Limbaugh", "I agree with Sarah Palin", or "I agree with Al Sharpton." Sorry, but they are sensationalist idiots who strive on building hatred among us.

He's the loudest voice drawing attention to the elephant in the room. You can feel free to say "I agree with Donald Trump" I promise I won't dwell.

[Frank Nit]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

He released his short-form "certificate of live birth" before being elected in 2008. After losing the race, some desperate McCain supporters tried to continue the fight by calling that document fake, at which point the director of Hawaii’s Department of Health confirmed that Obama was born in Honolulu. From that point on, the issue was dead in the media until Trump started feeling needy for attention.

This was a non-story three years ago. It's a non-story today. Your time would be better spent doing just about anything else other than listening to this bullshit.

the government lies to you. Every single day. About issues extremely more important than this

Seriously. Keep reading, but find better sources. Just take a look around that site for a minute, and tell me if that article still holds any weight in your mind. Xenophobia central.

Also, buzzfeed did it better, and they put it out just hours after the official birth certificate was released. http://www.buzzfeed.com/gavon/top-20...-already-sprun

[TheRuleofThree]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Really great detective work here. Clearly we're on the verge of uncovering a massive conspiracy that multiple state governments and the federal government itself was clearly either unable to uncover itself or fully complicit in from the moment Obama declared himself a candidate for President (nevermind his established career in state and federal Senate prior to his campaign).

Tell me, how did they arrange to have his birth announced in a local Hawaiian paper in the same week all those years ago? You think his mom was part of the conspiracy to make him President?

Yes, that must have been it.

http://reason.com/blog/2008/07/23/hey-barack-obama-exists-after

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Just like Bush did? Obama, by any worldly measure, is a centrist.

If that is your qualifier, Bush is a centrist, as well.
---

We do?

Clearly not. Sorry to hear that.
---

McCain refers to Obama as "That one" and it's perfectly apt for the point I'm making.

What the fuck does McCain have to do with the article in question? You are the only person talking about McCain.
---

Some dude with a lot of free time? who gives a shit.

Yeah, some guy with a lot of free time, like Donald Trump.

I'm not talking about random people or even comedian pundits, I'm talking about POLITICIANS

That is a VERY thin line, Al Franken, and a very weak argument.

dehumanizing and illegitemizing Obama for stupid reasons, that are clearly based on more than his and his party's policies.

What do you know about the author of the article? I find it pretty offensive that you instantly call the guy a racist without knowing anything about him.
---

Seriously. Keep reading, but find better sources. Just take a look around that site for a minute, and tell me if that article still holds any weight in your mind. Xenophobia central.

I noticed that. I still found it interesting.
---

You can feel free to say "I agree with Donald Trump" I promise I won't dwell.

That's where you should dwell. I don't agree with Donald Trump on much of anything. Clearly you have done some selective reading in this thread.
---

Because it was not his decision on whether or not to release the document? It was the state of Hawaii that had refused to release the original document, since they no longer gave out that version. They gave Obama the same version they would give anybody else who went there today and requested their birth certificate.

Why did it become legal after 2 years? I just think it's a sketchy story. Forgive me for always voting republican and wearing only Rush Limbaugh ties. I am really just a racist who hates that our president is half-black.

[FeebleFables]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

If that is your qualifier, Bush is a centrist, as well.

He certainly was a big government republican.

Clearly not. Sorry to hear that.

No problem, sorry you presumed.

What the fuck does McCain have to do with the article in question? You are the only person talking about McCain.

Listen man, you don't get to control the conversation however you want it. I made a comment stating that all of this bullshit: birthers (including McCain), Nazi calls, commie calls, shit, the whole tea party movement against a centrist president is more than it seems, and a lot of it is thinly veiled racism. Deal with it. Agree or disagree. But I'm not going to play by rules you decide to inject into this thread. Sorry I don't give as much weight to this article as you do.

Yeah, some guy with a lot of free time, like Donald Trump.

Right.

That is a VERY thin line, Al Franken, and a very weak argument.

Keep telling yourself that there's no difference between what an elected public official says and does vs. some comedian or internet photoshopper. I never said it didn't happen on both sides either, but I haven't seen the dehumanizing and illegitemizing to this extent from the other side.

What do you know about the author of the article? I find it pretty offensive that you instantly call the guy a racist without knowing anything about him.

I never called him a racist specifically, he very well may not be, but I do think all of this bullshit is born of it.

That's where you should dwell. I don't agree with Donald Trump on much of anything. Clearly you have done some selective reading in this thread.

Well, you certainly both agree that reason isn't good enough to put this issue to rest. No, wait, Trump put this to rest.

[AnewKINDofFEELING]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Well, you certainly both agree that reason isn't good enough to put this issue to rest. No, wait, Trump put this to rest.

I concede. You are clearly incapable of reading.

[TheRuleofThree]

Re: The Birth Certificate debate rages on

Still waiting to hear how the newspaper that announced his birth and Obama's mother were part of the conspiracy.
---

If that is your qualifier, Bush is a centrist, as well.

I don't really want to engage this since I'd love to keep the attention on the preposterous concept that Obama is a foreign-born non-citizen that successfully infiltrated American politics and won a national election so that he could transform the country through revolutionary policies like a healthcare bill rooted in Republican-proposed concepts, an increase in forces in Afghanistan, continued investment in the drug war, increasing deportations of illegal immigrants, and similar policies.

But I'm also really interested in knowing what part of Bush's "achievements" as President inspire anyone to call him a centrist. And no snark here, I'm actually very curious.